Positions still ‘quite far apart’ at EU budget summit

Yummy - Strasbourg pudding all round..

T gibbon

I have always understood that France needs the CAP subsidy to maintain small French farms that have been subdivided by inheritance law to unsustainable sizes .
It has been said that the subsidy in fact goes to French farming interests in North Africa . I have stayed with friends in Southwest France , who have told me the much of the land which is in small ownership units is not productively farmed at all .

David Barnaby, 80% of french agriculture is owned by a handful of agro-industrialists whose intensive exploitation in absolutly massive pieces of land employs more engineers and tradesman than farmers. The CAP has always been supporting this dozen poductivist companies sharing basically 65% of french territory (almost twice the UK). Most Brussels money goes to them, which they invest more in machines and chemicals than people, and in so doing impose ridiculous prices on the thousands of small farmers still left who only share less than 20% of french agriculture. As the CAP works with quotas small farmers are less and less able to compete with the mega farms, and often have to concentrate on only one product, but they are miserable and bought out more and more. You only need to drive across France to realise the vastness of most exploitations and their use of advanced technology. The problem is that it's not the other EU citizens who endure all the health, environmental, and lanscape damages that this mecanised and intensive agriculture causes to the french countryside and its inhabitants.

Other EU countries should on the contrary put more pressure on France not to encourage this mad productivist agriculture that's only meant to fullfill quotas to sustain a certain price on the world stock markets and who's produce often ends up destroyed anyway, just so that Africa remains incapable of competing with France and starves some more!

David Barneby, You say "Britain needs to leave and let the mainland members do it how they like . I believe politicians are wrong to suppose that trading and business relationships will be blocked or come to an end , we buy more than we sell."

You are being far too theoretical. If anything, Britain's economic dependency on the continent has increased, since it was decided 50 years ago that the country must abandon EFTA and join the EU through economic necessity. If you look at it on a country to country basis, the EU represents 50% of Britain's trade. But the UK accounts for only 5% of trade for each of the other EU-countries who will be deciding EU economic policy after Britain has left.

And your approach is blasé. British trade would suffer if it left the EU, who could seriously claim otherwise? Apparently you are not involved in any risk taking international "business relationships" yourself. Otherwise you would be wondering who will be left to trade with if the London political and media bubble suddenly decides to make a "law" cutting your company off from the world's most important markets right on your doorstep, because they prefer the idea of you trading with unnamed markets far away who must abolish their trade barriers without demanding any regulations if they want to do business. Besides being willing to integrate their economy with Britain's, these alternative partners must be cheaper to access, represent over 20% of world trade, with democratic institutions, a highly skilled workforce and quality infrastructure, but not dare ask for any rules to manage the relationship. So far I can't see that happening.

Because such a place doesn't exist on this planet.

So if your cunning plan doesn't work out, and the UK outside the EU still needs to enjoy the same access to the single market as before, it will unfortunately have to contribute to the EU budget and sign up again to all those EU regulations, (like Norway and Switzerland do) continuing to apply European standards on bananas and other such bains of the london media intellectuals.

Becoming an EU satelite with no access to decisions, instead of an EU member, Out with opt-ins, rather than In with opt-outs. What progress!

UK-skeptic
" you are being far too theoretical ".
Of course one cannot know precisely how Britain's trading and relationships with the EU would be , if Britain left . However if you are going to quote figures , you need to look them up and give acurate ones ; even if throwing them off the top of your head fits your sarcstic reply.
As a general rule Britain trades 40% with the EU and 60% with the rest of the world . That must of course be subject of variation from year to year . For the most part over the years Britain has purchased more from EU countries than she sells . Is it possible that EU countries would refuse to trade , sell to Britain after her separation , or be forbidden by the EU ? I don't think so , neither do I think tariffs would be imposed , because Britain would receive not pay them .
I am sorry if you are an EU enthusiast and things are not going the way you would like to see for EU success , why don't you try to make an informed and constructive reply .

You have to understand that the British people were lied to , that Ted Heath and the British government took the British people into the EEC under false pretenses , we were lied to again in 1975 when there was a referendun on remaining in or leaving the EEC .
However much successive British government have tried to sell the EU to the British people , it is a NO GO , the people don't want to know . Britain's government is in a position where it tries to support the EU , but with a very negative population behind them .
British people's attitude has nothing to do with European relations , where we have many friends .
The Maastricht treaty placed EEC member governments in a blackmail situation , that if they didn't sign , that was the end of the EU for ALL member states .
John Major signed Maastricht in the full knowledge that he could scarcely get support from his government and threatened a general election if the didn't support him . He knew too that the people were against his signing Maastricht . Britain should never have gone beyond the EEC free traiding area .
The EU as now is a political entity , ever closer union , a single federal state , governed from Brussels , a single currency , till the EU is one enormous conglomerate , EUSSR .
Whatever the benefits or losses , British People want out .